From the Road: A Blog of a Crypto Vagabond

SPEAKERS

Isaiah Jackson, Elsa Ramon, Bill Deignan

NOTE: This was transcribed using “Artificial Intelligence, aka AI”, which explains why when you read it, we appear to be “Artificially Intelligent”. It’s a lot of words for a computer to digest, so, just listen to the podcast.

Elsa Ramon

Bill Deignan
We’re live.

Elsa Ramon
It’s go time again. We had a little break there, Billy. Yeah, we did last recording. Yeah,

Bill Deignan
I know you needed to get some time off and in a way with the family a little bit. I’m always needing to get some time off. Not always with the family. But you know, we’ve had a lot of good quality time in the past few months for sure.

Elsa Ramon
Yeah, that’s, I’m glad you call it quality time. That’s a good way to put it. It really has been though all joking aside, it and I joke about the time we’re spending not just with the kids, but also with my parents.

Bill Deignan
Oh, my goodness.

Elsa Ramon
We’ve spent a lot of time together and actually, it’s it’s really, I think the situation with this quarantine and everything has just really made me appreciate some things that maybe I forgot to appreciate. You know, as as as much as maybe sometimes my mom and I bump heads. You know, I’m gonna lay this time.

Bill Deignan
We’ll be talking about Cindy, I love her.

Elsa Ramon
I know you love my view and my mom get along great. But I it’s I what I was gonna say it was it made me realize there was going to be a time where I’m going to be glad that you know, we were all hunkered down together like this. So you know, those are some of the good things that come out of out of these situations. Right? Yeah.

Bill Deignan
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So we’re back to episode number four of so what about crypto?

Elsa Ramon
Yeah, I can’t believe we’re just going along. And so I’m I have just have to tell you, and people watching and listening, how excited I’ve been to talk to this next person because it not that I’m not excited to talk to every single person because everyone brings something different, which is what I love. I mean, we all bring something to the table and it’s all valuable for the most part, but yeah, I really really enjoy interviewing people that I’ve met in person and, and knew that they were going to be something special and then go back and check on them and see how they’re doing. You know, fast forward a year, two years, three years I’ve done that in the past when I was in TV news, I did stories where we would help people help people get justice, help people get something. And I would like to check back up on them like a year later and see how they’re doing. And it always just makes me so happy to see that for most of the time. They’re doing great and it’s nice to know that I was a small tiny part of that. So I’m really excited to talk to our next guest because this is where I feel we are now. I met him a year ago at the Bitcoin his conference and for people who are

Bill Deignan
Whose, whose conference was that,

Elsa Ramon
That’s Russell O’Connor. You guys, you know, NFL football player was most recently with the Chargers believe now he’s with the Carolina Panthers Super Bowl champ pro bowler, who’s very, very into bitcoin and so I got to go to his conference and meet him and get to know him. But while I was there, I met some really awesome people that I’m planning to do stories with and Isaiah Jackson was one of the people I knew that I was going to connect with, again, at some point because I knew he had something special. When he gave me this book. Let me take my pen out of it, because I made a million notes, Bitcoin in black America, look at my notes, lots of notes. But I made the notes in this book that he gave me. Not just because I want to reference them maybe if something comes up a conversation during the podcast right now, but for myself to go back and check and I’ll explain why once we get started talking Talking with Isaiah because I want to bring him in and show him that. Isaiah, I still have the book you gave me when we met at Russell Kong’s conference last year in LA. And I’m even very proud of the fact that you also signed in fact, when you gave it to me,

Bill Deignan
Wow, Hey, could you maybe sign my Kindle version? We’ll be able to do that.

Isaiah Jackson
I’m sure we can work out a digital secret.

Elsa Ramon
I feel very special that I have this.

Isaiah Jackson
I do want to say I was nervous when I was going to give it to you. Because I did. Nobody there really knew who I was. Nobody. I just kind of showed up and I had in mind about five or six people I really wanted to get booked to use Spencer, Dinwiddie, Russell, of course a few other people so I was nervous just because I you know, sometimes you get people stuff. They’re like, Oh, that’s cool, and then they never explore it but uh, I’m glad you did. I’m glad everybody’s taking a liking to the book. And this is a great time to discuss it. Glad to be here.

Elsa Ramon
I, you know, I we’re very glad you’re here too. And I really feel honored that you’re here because I know right now in light of everything that’s happening around us in this world, I’m sure you’ve been so very busy talking with everyone, because we really brought a spotlight. You know, the unfortunate horrible situations that are happening have brought a spotlight to something that you’ve known. I’ve known to some degree, many people have known for many, many years, which is the problem of systemic racism and problems in our society with that, and I, I feel like I I hope that that wasn’t the only reason for people to talk to you about your book and why it’s important, you know, because it is, you know, maybe people see it as the topic of the moment but it’s not of the moment for People who have experienced it their whole lives, it’s not about a moment, this is a whole lifetime of stuff. So, um, you know, are you finding that you’re surprised by some of the people that are reaching out to you?

Isaiah Jackson
Yes, I am. I do believe there is a fair amount of people who may be doing a little bit of virtue signaling just sort of reaching out because it’s a good time period. For the most part, most of the people that have reached out have been sincere in their plight to try to include the black community and Bitcoin, as well as the economic improvements we need. I will say the biggest shout outs I’ve gotten or people that have helped came before these unfortunate events. However, it is good to see that people who did like the book and then they saw these protests happening sort of took it upon themselves to to hold times and protest, which that picked up really big on social media and, you know, those people read the book way before this happened. So, you know, there are a few people that are just taking advantage of the moment. But for the most part, people recognize the importance of this book when it came out last year in July. So now that we’re about a year for it, I believe this is a great time to discuss it. And and like you said, you know, some people are doing it just for the time period. But if that’s what gets them into the game gets them into actually helping in solving this problem. Racism is so big.

Elsa Ramon
Well, that’s a very good attitude to have about it. You know, I mean, I guess you do, also on your end to have to take advantage of the fact that you’re being given a platform to and which is what you wanted to do with the book in the first place. So I really hope that people truly take what they’re going to find in this book to heart but before we get to that, I know your life is not what it was a year ago. Things have really, really been great for you your book is doing very well. And it was doing well before we have found ourselves in this situation in history. But before you wrote the book, could you ever imagine that you’d be where you are right now?

Isaiah Jackson
I could imagine it but it had no, I really didn’t think of

Elsa Ramon
It like what you imagined, I guess would be I

Isaiah Jackson
Mean, you always have dreams. I mean, as you’re writing the book and think to yourself, you know, this will take off and, you know, people around the world are going to read it and be impacted and they’re going to help themselves. And you know, as it’s happening now, it really is taking off but just the amount of feedback and how much people liked it. I did not expect it. I’m one of my worst critics. I don’t think I’m that great of a writer. I think I have a lot of passion. So it comes out on the pages and information so people understand it, but you know, one of my face critics but everybody who loves it when everybody who has responded to it has made me feel more secure. So Yeah, at this point, I’m starting to believe it. And you know, a year ago, it was a totally different world for me, and you know, there’s sort of a whirlwind but I enjoy it. Love it. Okay, I can’t wait to keep it going for the foreseeable future.

Elsa Ramon
I’m so happy for you. I just love nothing more than to see people succeed, especially people like you who are doing something very incredible and very selfless, to spend the time learning so that you can teach other people. But before you got to the book, you had a completely different life. You were just like most of us who thought we get it, you know, go to school, get a career, pay our dues work for nothing, you know, basically work our way up and it seemed like an insurmountable task. You were a teacher.

Isaiah Jackson
Yes. come from a family of teachers. So so you know, my mother Teacher, teachers, my grandmother is a teacher, you know, have cousins that are teachers now, I have a family full of educators. And that was my first job out of college. My first official job, I taught high school in Raleigh, North Carolina, shout out to East Lake High School, getting my first job there. But as much as I wanted to be an educator, I realized that the public education system was tainted. It was underfunded it would the teachers were overworked. As I described in the book, we’ve made basically just enough money to go back to work. You know, that’s teachers are notoriously underpaid. And one of the things I wanted to point out being an educator, and you know, moving forward is that teaching people about subjects can be done in any form. I just got out of public education decided to go with Bitcoin because, in my opinion, once you learn something that’s valuable, and you apply it to your life, and it works, you should teach other people how to do it, and that’s what I’ve been doing the last seven years now.

Elsa Ramon
A teacher though.

Isaiah Jackson
Doesn’t go away. So yeah,

Bill Deignan
Yeah. Seven years, man, that’s like, that’s dedication, man cuz like, yeah, I mean, you just look at early bitcoiners you know, they talk about, you know, not knowing if this thing was gonna take off or not and just had a passion. You know, you you kind of went through that I’m sure but you also took it upon yourself to write a book and sort of, you know, try to start a movement to help people, which, you know, is probably to some degree, a thankless task for a pretty long time. But, uh, you know, did you ever reach a point you’re like, man, I just don’t know if it was worth it. You know?

Isaiah Jackson
You know, you know, the physical part of me was a few times I was just like, why do I care so much? You know, I mean, it’s like, especially you know, as Bitcoin gained in price from a money transfer, money point of view, I really didn’t need to do it, but from a spiritual standpoint I spent a lot of time talking to people about meditation and how I speak with my ancestors a lot of times and try and get things from family members. It was just my plight to show people in my community. Why Bitcoin was important simply because every time I would come up with solutions or come up with things, it’s one of those things where you kind of look around is like, why am I talking about this? Why is this not on, you know, every conversation that we have? And that was the reason for getting into consulting and then on to the book. So, yeah, it’s just something in me that I felt I had to do. And I think everybody who’s successful at anything has a has should have the plight to reach back and teach other people and it doesn’t feel like work. I mean, every day I wake up, it feels it feels good to help other people get into bitcoin because I can say I don’t need to do it. I definitely want to do it. And I think that’s why the response is so organic, and has been as good as it is.

Elsa Ramon
Isn’t that incredible, though, because I say I feel the same way that you know, I was in television news 21 years working for the network’s and once I learned all about this and what it was about, it’s only been, I guess about a year and a half, almost two years. I felt compelled to do something with this knowledge about Bitcoin and blockchain I really became consumed and very compelled like you to show people why this is important when I first learned about it at this private event. As the people on the panel were explaining what it was, I was looking around the room going, are you guys getting this because nobody’s seemed moved. But I was really like, Oh my god, this is this is incredible. Like, I wanted to jump up and guard you people hearing this, you know, it’s like, you’re telling them they want a million dollars to their face, and they’re just sitting there like, yeah, I mean, I so I know that feeling that compulsion that makes you feel like you want to teach people about this because I left TV news to start over and and do this, the podcast but which was recent, but our content that Bill and I have spent over the last year and a half, two years shooting to teach people but that’s the thing about Bitcoin and blockchain and, and everything in between that once you learn about it, it’s like this light switch is flipped and you do feel the need to tell everybody about it because to me, it’s justice. It’s social justice. And that’s one of the reasons why I got into TV news, you know, you want to get people justice, you want to help people you want to tell their stories. And you know, as a teacher, same thing, you want to help people you want to teach them you want to give them advantages. This is a no brainer. This is like the ultimate justice right? The ultimate advantage.

Isaiah Jackson
Absolutely. And, you know, I sort of compare finding out about bitcoins and follow them Look, you got to be a little crazy to get into it. Go to world, right? So sort of how most people go about when they find out about Bitcoin. It’s sort of like, like you said, a light switch goes off, then you start to, in my opinion, you start to question a lot of the things you would talk about the financial industry, and then you dig a little bit deeper, you don’t have to go as deep as I did. I definitely went down the wormhole a few nights. But if you go just a little bit deeper, you can see the corruption that has happened, and why this is needed. Like you said, You sit there and say, Hey, are you guys here like this? by me jumping up and down. Most people don’t, then that they’re even if you have money, you shouldn’t you should have more. You see your perfect, be worth more. Your taxes should not be as much as they are. The oversight in the financial industry should not be as much as it is. So even if you’re doing okay, you can do better. So everybody should be on board to try and change the system.

Elsa Ramon
In fact, it’s almost worse to me You’re doing quite well. Because I think the lesson disadvantaged a person is a less marginalized community is they’re not as quick to see why this is so important. When you peel back the layers of how banks are run, how corporations are run, how Wall Street is run, you start to see just below the surface, holy crap. There’s a lot of bad stuff here. That’s happening. And we’re all just a bunch of worker bees. And, boy, this is things could be a lot different in so many ways, but it’s just below the surface. I used to call it the golden handcuffs, because I made really good money as an on air television anchor reporter but those are like golden handcuffs because I believed I was I had a good and I really had no idea even at As a reporter and somebody who’s in news, I really had no clue what was really going on? financially.

Isaiah Jackson
Exactly. And that’s why we have to work harder to get this financial education out. And also, you know, going forward to the future. Most of the people that I’ve discussed Bitcoin with our industry that are big winners, they’ve all kind of echo the sentiment that you talk someone that country, like Zimbabwe, a country like South Africa, or Venezuela or India or somewhere where you can basically say, hey, this money is a hedge against your government. They get it and they don’t even don’t even question it. Like any anything is better than what we have to deal with, with Americans. Because for a lot bitcoiners I talked to her like, yeah, Americans will question you for years, not just, you know, people that still to this day, like, well, I still don’t understand what I’m like, see, as an American, you think our money is safe, it never happened to us, even though the Fed is trying to fool the dollar as we speak. They’re literally doing it right. In front of you, that is one of the things I think long term international countries get it faster so they’ll actually act on it and innovate faster than us will at this point Where’s with political preparations? And no, I just think that is the sense makes a lot of bitcoins in industry.

Elsa Ramon
And, you know, we we see things from afar too. We look at ourselves as Americans and see stuff on the news and go, Wow, at least we’re not Venezuela. I mean, boy, those poor people really don’t know what you truly have it like here and what you could have it like here in the United States, we are very much in belief that we truly are financially free and the banks work for us and you know, things are running fine. This is how I pay for things cash, debit card, credit card, this, it’s good, it’s good. I know where my money is. It’s I led to believe it’s safe here. And you know, I don’t know about you, Isaiah, but the biggest questions I get from people who asked He started asking questions about Bitcoin. biggest questions, Is it safe? Um, you know, because nobody wants to find out that their money disappears into thin air one day, you know, like, oh, if they were hacked or or whatever, you know, is it safe? What can it do for me? Why should I leave what I already know, it seems to be working fine. My bank is fine. You know, using the credit cards are fine. My job is fine. So the biggest hurdle I have with people absolutely.

Bill Deignan
Like, like you said, until it isn’t, and that seems to me to be kind of the theme, maybe of your book, among others. And I’d love for you to elaborate a bit on the sort of, you know, strategy that you would want to employ to empower black people to take on you know, their own sort of sovereignty. But you know, one thing that stood out in your book And as I was reading it is a line that you said that said, you know, people used to look at Bitcoin through the lens of desperation and not emancipation.

And but how do you get other people to look at it that way?

Well, man, you know, how do you see that like literally playing out?

Isaiah Jackson
Oh, yeah, great question. So as far as emancipation, and as how I described it, the reason it does for you is because it gives you self sovereignty, it gives you the ability to control your own money. And the conversation right now around a lot of black Americans is sort of a perfect storm, because a lot of black Americans are saying, All right, we’re in a system that doesn’t care about us. So what are the solutions for the future? And we want real true economic freedom. Bitcoin can be there to do that. And I think when people see the price, it brings them in, but when they figure out why they need it, why the system or how the system has, you know, systematically held them back. I think that Teaching people that most of the times once I get through the first three or four slides that describe banks and redlining and some of the discriminant discriminatory loan practices, most black people are like, you run it, they really don’t care about it. So they go from that. And then I offer a solution of Bitcoin and that’s sort of how we get them to realize that and as far as security, when people ask about security, Bitcoin has not been hacked people have and you do need to have good security. It’s sort of like if somebody robbed a bank and you decided not to use cash anymore. It doesn’t make any sense. People get robbed not Bitcoin security. Bitcoin has had pretty much 100% uptime, Bitcoin itself has never been hacked. And the security that you need can be taught by people like myself, but if you don’t want to hold on to it, we have a lot of third party custodial services that will hold it big go others that can hold it in cold storage, which were not available when I first started. They are available today though, so it’s a lot easier to onboard people. Want to make them feel comfortable about moving their Bitcoin but you do want to make sure you control those private keys not your keys, not your coins. So make sure you have wallet, keys.

Elsa Ramon
Right, which is a pretty common thing in in this community not your keys not your coin a Mac, just for the new people who are just learning, by the way, a lot of the things that that Isaiah said some of the words that bill is at and I have said you could either find defined in the book or you know, Google them just to get familiar with some of the terminology because I know it’s a little overwhelming to hear all these words flying at you and people might have the tendency to go I don’t understand this. I’m just gonna shut down you know, and obviously we don’t want them to do that. But I along the lines of not looking at Bitcoin as a get rich quick type of thing. I know people hear those stories. It’s like, Oh, I bought Bitcoin at you know, $1 and now it went up to 20 grand, you know, it’s it’s not just a About that, yes, of course, people are interested in making money and bettering their lives. But it’s a lot more than that, which is very well detailed in the book. But another thing along the lines that bill brought up, desperation versus emancipation is another theme that you’ve threaded through the entire book is the thought of self fulfilling prophecy. What do you mean by that, when you talk about that as, as a thought, or mean at least thought a community should have? And keep in mind when they think about Bitcoin?

Isaiah Jackson
Yes, so we’ve discussed a lot in my community and with my family, amongst other people about group economics, and about being able to support black owned businesses in order to keep the dollars in our community and basically uplift ourselves and Bitcoin can be a self fulfilling prophecy because if we decide to practice group economics, and we also want to increase the wealth of our community, if you use Bitcoin and use it for payments and it is part of the circular economy. It doesn’t have to be completely Bitcoin but for the most part, people have it as an option. And they’re holding it at for savings businesses and individuals. A self fulfilling prophecy comes about when you say we need to have a circular economy, which happens and our bodies decrease, which if you look at Bitcoin over time, has increased from six cent 10 years ago to almost 10,000 today, which I think it will continue on because of the value proposition. So if you start that circular economy, you get basically a self fulfilling prophecy of using better money to, you know, basically create group economics and also increase the value of that community all at the same time and basically kill two birds with one stone,

Elsa Ramon
Which then leads to sovereignty.

Isaiah Jackson
I mean, then you can, then you can hire private police that will not kill you in the street. Well, guess what last what can be achieved you can get health care That doesn’t disproportionately kill black women, you know, you can get banks that actually give loans based on your merit and not based on your skin color or your zip code. These things can happen once you have sovereignty and you can’t really achieve it until you have something like Bitcoin.

Elsa Ramon
Right, which people don’t understand when you start to see it through those lenses, you really start to understand that, wow, okay. Banks have a lot of power as you outlined in your book, and which is information all over the internet, the Federal Reserve, if I get this right, gives the banks the money, and then the money. The people at the banks get to decide who gets it and who doesn’t. And then when you add in things like prejudice, systemic racism, you know all those things. You see how it becomes less and less available to certain amounts of people and certain genres and people’s, you know, and so on and so forth. You see the layers. And once you can start seeing the layers of how we get to the point where we are today, that’s when the light switch goes up, I would hope for people to see why sovereignties just not this word that means, oh, so we’re free. Yeah, well, we’re already free. Well, we’re not really. And I think people need to go back and understand what sovereignty truly means, and go back and re examine whether or not we as Americans are truly sovereign.

Isaiah Jackson
Exactly. I think the term has, basically it had a stopping point. It was sovereign, you can be a sovereign as you want. You can grow your food, establish your own water system, maybe have electricity grid. You can build your house. You can do all these things and become sovereign, but it always stopped at money, because money was always control since 1913, since Federal Reserve was created, and I don’t think there is Too many people alive who were here when it was created. Plenty of us, but most people don’t have any idea of a money system outside of the control that the Federal Reserve has had. So when you create or come up with something new, it is sort of hard to get people to understand that you can be sovereign, you can not use a bank can have your own money, groups of people can get together and decide we don’t want to use that money anymore. We’ll use something else that is very possible today and your sovereignty starts with money, that is the root of it, then everything else that that you want to do is dependent on that. So yes, that is that is being a true sovereign individual is having that money and being able to use it. It’s unconscious skateable. And that’s in a censorship resistant nobody can stop you from using it. Great, which is great news for black in it.

Bill Deignan
Well, you know, I, I completely agree, but also and also in reading your book, felt like well, this is a call for everyone to learn about and learn about The potential of it. But I think you’ll agree with me when I say that there’s a long, long road ahead of not only getting everyone to sort of buy into the idea of sovereignty and using Bitcoin and all of these things that are in your book. But for people that don’t already have a lot of capital, you know, they’re living paycheck to paycheck and just maybe trying to get food on the table. It seems like part of your book, as you know, certainly promoting the idea of saving, investing, speculating, those are paths to some of Fluence that Bitcoin can offer in somewhat, you know, huge ways, we hope. But how do you you know, you had to personally I’m sure, take a make a decision to go I’m going to put some of my money aside into this Bitcoin thing because I can see the big picture. But we all know that there’s just a gigantic part of the world that doesn’t see it, yet. And won’t see it until it’s too late. You know, they’ll FOMO into it and then get wrecked. And so what do you do? Like, how can you go about literally sounding the alarm bells to people?

Isaiah Jackson
I think one of the best ways is using outlets from very popular people. To get the word out. I do want to shout out jack Dorsey, creative Twitter. He shouted out the book in February, which was huge. And as soon as that happened, that’s sort of like ringing the alarm that yes, Bitcoin in black America is a thing. You know, people in the black community are starting to wake up. So reaching out to people like that. I’ve had a few famous people have posted it on their Instagram with millions of followers. So sort of ringing the alarm that way and then also being able to once I get them back on the book tour, being able to talk to people talking to the right people, not necessarily all the people because there are certain people like Dr. Claude Anderson, who’s big economics of black community, pastors, where 80% of the black community attend some sort of religious activity, getting the words to them, so that they can get it to their parishioners or to their followers and users is is paramount right now. And that’s what I’ve been working on for the past few months getting into them. So then when they talk to the people that believe what they’re saying, or that trust in their advice, hopefully I can convince them so that they can convince others. So that is, that’s the plan. And you mentioned Russell Kong earlier, getting him actually planning a Bitcoin in black church, a bookstore. So just so we can actually get the word out to some of these big churches, who take in time millions of dollars in times of year, but but they have no option for Bitcoin to hold it as an asset for later, much like the Catholic Church. So, you know, we’re working on that now. And that is one of the ways to bring the alarm, so to say,

Bill Deignan
Yeah, I mean, from a threat of fear.

Elsa Ramon
though, Bill, yeah. fear among any community that want to let go of their money and do it. in a different way, it’s very,

Bill Deignan
That’s true of all of us. But, you know, I just, I think, if I understood correctly in the book, one of the strategies, you know, extolled was to really find a way for people to have to pay with Bitcoin. And you’re like I My mind goes directly to like hip hop artists or people who create a product that’s highly desirable but are willing to say I’m gonna go out on a limb and just only sell my product for Bitcoin. But it’s got to be somebody huge this just like hits the like, almost on a legendary scale of this is a new way of doing business in the music business, for instance. Are you seeing any of that to where a person’s willing to just put it all on the line, you know, that you know, name the large the biggest, you know, let’s say Jay Z. What if he just all of a sudden said I’ll never sell anything unless it’s with Bitcoin? Are there people thinking that way?

Isaiah Jackson
I will say, from what from the hip hop artists, the entertainers that I know most of them see Bitcoin as an investment, because that’s how it was presented to them, usually their financial advisors. I’m not saying I’m smarter than them, but most of them were so late, they can only really see it as an investment and they heard it just in passing. However, there are people like Russell Kuhn, like Spencer, Dinwiddie who are saying, pay me in Bitcoin, I only want to be, you know, I only want to be paid in Bitcoin, the people that we need to say that I believe there’s some politics at the top people like Jay Z, maybe Beyonce, some people or Bron, James, some of the politics that goes into the money that they get in endorsements may hinder that, but I don’t think they’re gonna have a choice. At a certain point, you’re gonna hop on the train like everybody else, you know, every everybody has, you know, their period of, you know, I don’t know if bitcoins gonna work and then a little bit happens, you know, over the years, and I’m like, Oh, this is real. Oh, so this is real as well. I think what’s gonna happen is it’s going to get into society. So They won’t have a choice but to accept Bitcoin. And it’ll be, in my opinion a better choice. And once we get one big person to say, You’re right, the ripple effect will be huge.

Elsa Ramon
But I agree though, with you as a as it’s, it’s great to get big names like Russell and well Russell has a much deeper understanding and my opinion of what Bitcoin is beyond way beyond an investment. But even getting famous people like Beyonce and Jay Z and those types of people a con even but he also has a deeper understanding as well a con for people who are listening is a singer, rapper, entertainer, very obviously very popular, very famous, but he has an a deeper understanding. If you look him up, he’s got a much deeper understanding of what it’s about as well. But I think ultimately, it’s a Slidell people who are going to drive some of those big names to say well, my fans are demanding that They pay for concerts, or at least have the option to pay for concerts with Bitcoin or some other, you know, a theory, which is an alternative coin, which is all explained in the book, but also if you start searching for people who are listening, they just want options to pay in different types of cryptocurrencies or digital currencies, that is going to drive some of those very famous people into the fans.

Bill Deignan
Also, you know, and I agree completely with both of you. But just to be clear, what I was referring to is not so much the legendary name of a person, but someone who’s willing to put their product out that they have a highly desirable product. And that that forces people to use it to purchase that product, whether it’s music, or any other thing, tickets to football games, anything but something needs to happen that sort of forces people into that economy and gives them that huge desire to To get Bitcoin to spend it, and because they have no choice because they want that product. I don’t know what it is. But you know, we don’t see enough of that, you know, to benefit any community yet. And so, again, my fear is that, you know, we’re all too late to the game, if we don’t start waking up to it and what makes that happen. So that’s where I think I’m referring to maybe needing some help from the bigger name people to go out on a limb and say, we’re just gonna force you to do it. I don’t know who they are what they have, but something’s got to make people want to use it more. I hope before it becomes so desperate that you have to use you know that it’s going to be hurtful if you don’t, you know,

Isaiah Jackson
well, we have some bridges to that. That time period you’re thinking of where somebody will be forced to use Bitcoin for. It has some product right now you have like fold that is one sir. You actually get savings if you pay for things within So if you have consumers that are saying hey I can save you 10% on my Starbucks or my Amazon payment or target if I pay with Bitcoin they will start using it instead of fiat currency it’s a very new company it’s a very you know, not a new concept I think gift that is the first to do cash back rewards or to give discounts to pay in Bitcoin but stuff like that as well as you know, Mark Cuban accepting Bitcoin for the Dallas Mavericks games. He didn’t wire it, but if he for some reason say we’re only accepting Bitcoin for merchandise that will be a catalyst sort of what you’re saying so we’re on the bridge there this is just a top my head which you I think, I think somebody will pull that but I think, you know, let’s say Bitcoin past the all time highs this year, somebody’s going to do it before the end of this year. I mean, that’s, that’s because people FOMO into it. The mindset is, okay, well, Bitcoin doesn’t go away. It’s not going away anytime soon. In our rather have big wine which you know, a lot of people send somebody wants, the price goes up, and then that brings them in. But what keeps them there is the actual use case.

Bill Deignan
So as part of your premise in the book, as I understand it, that if you could get the black community to get involved early enough, that when there’s this gigantic boom in Bitcoin, and it becomes the sort of reserve currency, they’re ahead of the game and can profit and be more enriched in that. If they don’t do it now, now that we have institutional money coming in and sort of raking it in and taking a bigger share of it, how can you expedite that knowledge? Because there’s really as a time of the time is of the essence type thing, what you know, what do you think about that?

Isaiah Jackson
Well, I’ve provided dozens of tutorials, hours of tutorials Of course, writing the book, working on a follow up to the book, etc, Second Edition, trying to get the word out as fast as possible to as many People and like you said institutional money money is coming in and also not just focusing on Bitcoin and the price going up but also positioning yourself to get blockchain certifications to get jobs in the blockchain field to apply blockchain or Bitcoin to your business you already have. Because even if you can’t buy it, there are people who are accountants or lawyers who do freelance work. If they can just accept Bitcoin as payment, they can acquire Bitcoin over time, so they won’t necessarily have to buy it. It’ll just be a valuable asset that they will probably rather accept than cash. So I think that is one way to appease people on the way there but yes, definitely time is of the essence. I’ve tried to be as urgent with my message, which is why I wrote it a year ago because I think 2020 something biggest I didn’t know. But I knew it 2020 big Well,

Isaiah Jackson
It’s always something.

Elsa Ramon
Well, 2020 especially has seemed incredibly exhausting. And we’re just halfway through. It’s we and we have a long way to go. But another thing that really struck me about your book was reminding people that we don’t owe the banks or anybody anything as far as putting our money there or using them to be able to shop and purchase and save and put our money away. I think one of the barriers that I have found with people is that they have a hard time understanding that peer to peer Bitcoin, being able to pay peer to peer and how you want with the bank in the middle and going right over the bank. It’s hard for them to visualize that because, again, that’s been burned in our minds that you need a bank. So when a lot of people who are outside in this community here, oh, you can be your own bank and banking the unbanked they seem like just throw away phrases or sayings to people who aren’t in this industry or in this space. How important is it for people to understand that part of Bitcoin?

Isaiah Jackson
Oh yeah, that is prop that is probably the most important part of Bitcoin as far as learning how it’s actually used why you need it is the most important part because like I said, price can go up all you want want people to actually be able to use it. And banking the unbanked is the point of crypto basically, you know, moving away from banks is big, of course, but no in the black community is 20% of our community is unbanked. And you know, some of that comes from the distrust of banks from older black people. I do a lot of people community that used to keep cash in the mattress. They didn’t trust banks 50 years ago, and I think it’s the craziest thing ever. But growing up, now I see why they thought that way, they just didn’t have another option. And now they do. And I think I’m banking or banking on banks, so to say with crypto is the mission and getting people to join the financial system to be able to make quick payments for cheap, cheap, very low price is the point. And we want to get people to be able to do that in every community. But, of course, you know, over time, it’ll take some time. But that is the point is to get people who are not a part of the financial system into the financial system.

Elsa Ramon
I know in the Latino community, you’re probably very well aware of this. There are a lot of Latinos who don’t have bank accounts for the same reasons. They just trust. They don’t want to put their money in there. They think they’re going to be targeted for whatever reasons, whether they’re here undocumented or documented and they have people in the family who aren’t documented for whatever the reasons And so a lot of people in the Latino community use services like Western Union and all these money services that wire money to family in other countries. One of the things I want the Latino community to learn is that there is another way. Because if they go to some of these services, these wiring services, they get charged huge fees, if you’ve ever used Western Union, you know, and I’m not singling them out. Services, like Western Union all involve big fees. And it takes time and you got to go down there and it’s, you know, people send money home often enough that this could become a real time consuming, expensive thing to do. So for the Latino community, I can see it being beneficial that way because they can send Bitcoin directly to family instantly and with very tiny fees. But it’s the same for everybody else too. If you want to wire money to family, or get money to people in other countries or you have business transactions, going through a bank is also cumbersome and expensive as well. So I try to use these examples to explain to people how cool it would be if you could just jump over that barrier of a bunch of fees and holding up your money and worrying about whether or not the bank is going to question you why it’s going where it’s going. All the other things that people have become afraid of, that they can just skip all that get the money to their loved ones, or whoever it is they want to get it to to get it to. And wow, you did all of this without a bank.

Isaiah Jackson
Absolutely. And I agree totally with you. My Latino brothers and sisters. I have really I my ex girlfriend isn’t single. So I’ve been deepen the community and discuss a lot of these things. With remittance payments sending back home being like you said one of the biggest things um, it’s a very cash based economy, you know, in a lot of Latino neighborhoods is very cash based, but unfortunately our economy is moving to a cashless economy. So you’re literally leaving out millions of people as soon as they start saying more cashless businesses, unfortunately, where I live in LA, I’ve seen three new businesses become cashless in the face of the COVID-19 so like I said, we have sort of a perfect storm of digital money coming in germs like people don’t want to

Bill Deignan
Dirty Fiat.

Isaiah Jackson
Yeah, it’s it’s funny that it started out as a meme and it’s, it’s literal now. So when you want a cashless society coming and digital payments, provide oversight that some people in the community do not want like you said they’re they’re scared for their family or for others that they there may be some sort of, you know, oversight they don’t want Yeah, Bitcoin seems like a no brainer, but Like you said, some people have to realize they need it, and then getting the proper education. And then you go from there. And like I said, hopefully one day, I can see Bitcoin in brown America, from somebody because I think they have this as much light as I do to discuss economic disparities. And

Elsa Ramon
So, around America…

Bill Deignan
That’s your next book. So…

Elsa Ramon
My next book.

Bill Deignan
So let me ask you this, you know, you talk a lot about the black dollar in the book, which I’m not quite sure understood entirely. But one thing that did stand out to me is like, in my mind of what a black dollar could be, it would be like the project you referred to called qwop. I think is one yeah. grok coin, you know, just in looking at that looks like something that, you know, to me gives an opportunity for it to be a truly sort of enclosed economy, with your accumulated community based economy and is That part of the strategy part of the sort of goal of what you’re trying to, you know, propose. Absolutely. So explain that that little bit if you don’t mind.

Isaiah Jackson
Yes, yes, I’ll explain that as well. So the black dollar is a reference to black people using their dollars that they’ve had to circulate amongst their community because research has shown that a lot of immigrant communities we have in just in LA, we have Koreatown of Chinatown. We have a little Ethiopia. We have a lot of immigrant groups that stuck together and they own the businesses and the houses in the area. So the money is always circulated between them, they send each other’s kids and how basically, that is what is missing in the black community. We tried with, with group economics, with black Wall Street with rosewood with Wilmington and everybody got murdered. Literally. Not like something you see on TV and they just recipe No, they burned it to the ground. They murdered women. And children. And they said we do not want to see a the rise of a sort of economics from the black dollar because the strength it could have shown because people don’t realize the number one time for black owned businesses is now the second biggest time was the late 1800s. This is right. Right before Federal Reserve, when black people were left to their own wits, the black dollar was circulating just fine. And we were creating black Wall Street all around the country. Unfortunately, those were brick and mortar stores so they could be burned down. But today, the reason I’m so adamant about the black dollar and moving towards Bitcoin being that solution is you can’t burn down Bitcoin, you can’t there’s nothing you can do take it away. If we have a digital economy that is built, or that is uses Bitcoin, the only way it can be taken away is if you give it away. And I don’t think any black people are willing to do that after we’ve been through. So that is what I mean by the black dollar and group economics and how that works. Because it’s worked for a lot of other groups who have been left alone to build their their, their, their communities, because I mean, like I said, I mentioned Koreatown. They have businesses in their native language because they don’t even care if you know what it says on that side, because their community. I mean, the Hasidic Jews in New York, their communities, the police run away when they come outside, because they do not want those problems if they have to get sued, or if they mess with them, because the economic power they have in their community, they own it. That’s what that’s what happens. And unfortunately, we don’t have that as much in black communities. I would like to see a return to that in the brick and mortar space, but I know for a fact that can happen digitally. Hmm. So how would

Bill Deignan
You Sorry, also, I just wanted to ask if you could sort of explain that gwap coin and is that a possible illusion or like sort of something that brings it into just a community based currency so to speak?

Isaiah Jackson
Absolutely. So while coin is an example of a solution, there’s there’s other coins that have been created with this thought in mind. And yes, I believe Bitcoin is the crypto Current the reserve currency which you use, but as far as daily payment system, there may be something like one point that maybe a little faster, maybe a little bit easier for people to, to learn about and use. So I’m open to pretty much any project that will help with that. And I think what point can do that as well as some of the other projects I’ve seen come out as well.

Elsa Ramon
You know, some of the things are examples I like to give people who still are trying to grasp the concept of blockchain technology, which is the technology that Bitcoin runs on. I try to give them examples of them being able to do things that were only reserved for institutional investors, the very wealthy, insider people, people high society, and that is to do things like invest in art, real estate cars, but there’s a way to do that called tokenization. And I try to explain explain to people that there’s going to be a time one day that’s actually already happening now with certain companies where you never dreamed you’d be able to invest in art and cars and real estate. Because like Bill pointed out, most people and families are living paycheck to paycheck. I think the story that came out last year, I believe maybe us said USA Today. outline that most families don’t have $400 extra in case they encounter an emergency. So of course investing. I mean, that’s crazy talk, it would have been in my house. My parents were concerned about roof over the head, food on the table shoes on the feet and you go into school, you got those things, you’re good. There was no psychology and understanding and having discussions. It was very much really surviving. In our family. Yeah, I had to teach Ah, Mother, you know, so the odds were stacked against them and there, but there are a lot of families who have those kinds of challenges. So I try to explain to people which you also explained in the book that Imagine if like, say the Mona Lisa was put up for sale, and everybody had an opportunity to buy just a portion of it. I have $100, I want to invest into that Mona Lisa painting, and you can, and now because of tokenization, you put your hundred dollars for the token, and you own a teeny tiny bit of the Mona Lisa, or whatever commodity is tokenized. And the more you do that, and the more you build, something like that continues to gain value, and so your tokens gain value and you’re investing and companies are doing now with art. Real Estate and people for the first time in their lives are getting to see that maybe they get a piece of that pie.

Isaiah Jackson
Absolutely. And I’m so glad to see it. tokenization has been one of the subjects that is very interesting simply because that is going to change everything, there will be no reason for you to have to go through so much paperwork for real estate. Like you said, buying valuable things for a small fraction of the price of its profit is going to be very mind. So now we can just get regulators to back off a little bit. We can move forward a little faster, because you know, they still want to consider it. The same thing as before when this is something totally different. And tokenizing things has already worked for some people already in certain industries. And I think the innovation that comes from tokenizing stuff like NBA contracts or tokenizing you know, companies With investments from around the world, all of these things put people in a position to like you said, he’s a small amount of money to invest and move forward. And for people who thought you had to be an accredited investor, or to be rich to do this. So tokenization allows you to be a regular Joe Schmo. And you could spend $10 a week investing in certain things. So I love it. I think that is going to be paramount to the industry booming, long term. So are you is that part of your, you know, education is helping maybe future black business owners know that they could tokenize their business or portions of it or, you know, some of their intellectual property or any thing like that? Absolutely. I tell business owners that a lot of times real estate is where I focus when I talk about that, simply because I used to do it for a real estate law firm. So I got to see the ins and outs of how real estate works and how convoluted It was like if somebody bought a house They will have to come in, they’ll have to get their check and paper then for the bank to get paid. So I had to drive to the bank to take it to them. And it was so so many steps in between it was way too much. And that’s where the costs come in. That’s where sort of the time you save and fees, all that goes away when it’s tokenized when people can purchase it. And the investment into it can happen like that in 24 hours, so to say. So, yes, I focused more real estate when I talk about tokenization. But I do talk to business owners that because I use an example in the book, Don Dixon. She was the first black home business to tokenize, her resale for pop calm, and she raised 1.4 million. And so those tokens and it was successful, so it can be done. And it will be done in the future.

Elsa Ramon
I know Isaiah, you’re very passionate about this. I’m passionate about it. Bill’s very passionate about it. We’re driven, I think by a sense of justice. I think that’s very clear with you with all of us. But has there been any other experiences in your life that make you more sensitive to wanting to give justice? Like, have you experienced direct racism or prejudice throughout your life? And what were some of the incidents that stand out the most to you?

Isaiah Jackson
Oh, yeah. So I’ve been physically assaulted by police twice been what I mean, I could give the stories one mistaken identity. I went to a store beside a bank that had the robber earlier and the police ticker that went out to colleges, whenever you got an email. The description that they put was between five six to six, three black mill, black hoodie, in the middle of the winter, so it’s pretty much every black dude on campus. So I guess they thought I went back to the store. That’s Right beside the bank that was just robbed earlier. And they literally slammed on the ground, few bruises, nothing big but just to ask me about that. No, I was going to fail just to do that. please grab me out of the car. He just he walked into it. He didn’t say license Registration is open the door pulled me out. The CBOE actually stopped him from doing it. And because he, I guess, was embarrassed, just stop because I’m like, my seatbelt on. So I’ve been physically assaulted by cops I’ve had in educational circles. I’ve been a 4.0 student my whole life. I’ve gotten so many snarky remarks from a lot of white people who copied off my paper to get A’s or they will say, Hey, you got to get into this program because of affirmative action or I’m glad they got affirmative action. So you get into the school. Yeah. And a couple times for me, just a little snarky stuff like that. economically. I grew up in rough neighborhoods all the way up until 14. My mom was a teacher. So of course you can make a lot of money. So We live in a food desert. We live where there wasn’t really no healthy food options. Education was poor. Learning to me came directly from my mother because she was a teacher. My friends weren’t as fortunate. Even though I grew up in the same circumstance, I was doing the same stuff. Education was was lost at that capacity. Then as a black person seeing a lot of the things that has happened to us over the years, I have a grandmother who literally was at the tail end of slavery, she could literally describe these stories coming from them, the marches they had in 60s, a lot of the drug war, things that wreck the black community, I have friends who have gone to jail for years for doing a crime that was way less than some of my white friends who do all the time they don’t even get looked at. So as far as discrimination as far as black community as far as things we’ve gone through, I’ve gone through, I’ve gone through them to maybe a little bit more laid back only because you know, spiritually. I feel like there’s something for me so I don’t really worry about it. But yes, I have And this is not what I’m telling you is not like a, you know, out there walk on the street. And as Tim black, who’s the same question just asked me, you know, similar story. So, in my opinion, the stuff is happening, it’s not gonna stop me because I can’t look my children in the face and say, I’m sorry, I couldn’t, you know, support you because because of racism, I’m not gonna let that stop me. But yes, all this stuff has happened. And it pushed me to the point where I looked at the economic side of it, why does this stuff happen? and kind of put it all together? And that’s why I wrote the book. That’s why I’m doing what I’m doing. And we’ll continue to do it. I don’t plan on stopping anytime soon.

Bill Deignan
What do you think of the, you know, thought with the protests that are going on now? Is that do you feel like that’s all organic? Or is it a combination of people getting involved that really should have no business involved with it or you know, what’s your take on it?

Isaiah Jackson
So My take is, there are people who genuinely and organically want to march and want to have their voice heard. Unfortunately, our movement black people’s movement has been co opted by people that have no business there. I’ve seen enough vi deos, I’ve seen enough economic and financial evidence to suggest that certain movements do not benefit us. And if we want to talk about it, the statement, Black Lives Matter is true. But the organization is not helping us. So for anybody who is confused, I’m a black person telling you Black Lives Matter is not helping black people. And most organizations haven’t helped like people long term. They just have a black face on organization that does just enough to appease black people and everybody goes home. NAACP, I don’t know why they still have colored people in there. They don’t support us. Trust me these movements. In my opinion, there are people who feel out of it on a March, but the movement has been co opted by people who have way more money than I will ever have. And I know personally, there are actors who go out to a lot of these to these protests. There are provocateurs who show up just to wait for the crowd to get big and smash windows And then all of a sudden it’s looting. There is cooperation from police to leave a bait car, if you notice, there’s a big car at every single rally. It’s just one car sitting there burning. And then all the pictures, the media is in on it, because the media takes a picture of that burning cities on fire. Everything’s going one to hell. And it’s not. It’s one square blocks, and you could literally put the fire out in two seconds. So I think the movement has been co opted.

Bill Deignan
What do you think the motive is? What’s the motive for that?

Isaiah Jackson
Well, the motive for in my opinion, is economic. It always is what you want is you want people to be mad at the leadership, which is mostly Republican. So now you can put in democrats who can then get money and of course do what they do as far as donations, whatever that they’ve been doing with black people for years. I don’t think either party has our best interests at heart. Do not think either one of them supports us economically. It’s all a game and I think most black people are smart enough to realize that but they feel stuck. They like I want to support I want to go out and do something about it. But also understand some of this may be fake, and we’re stuck in between a rock and a hard place. That’s why I choose to focus on economics and not necessarily put myself in harm’s way physically because you could go out there and get killed or hurt for a cause that, to me was fabricated by a lot of organizations who have seen black people do this before and figured out how to make people mad how to provoke it, and then how to implement everything I just told you, the media, the police, and then certain other apparatuses to to to stoke the flames. And that’s what we’re seeing now. I do not I have not seen a group of black people, the protests, you know, basically go in and trying to mess everybody up. I have not seen that. I have seen teenagers who got paid by whoever somebody randomly offered hundred dollars. If you notice a lot of the windows get smashed out by a lot of young skateboarders because they’re paying young kids to literally run and they don’t know what’s going on. They just like a fire burning. Who cares? It’s summertime. It’s kids out of school. What were you doing back then so These are not. And I always say this, the black race is the only race that’s judged by the youngest of us. Because our entertainers, our professional athletes, our young kids, they’re the ones who are always on TV. And we’re like, why do you judge our entire race off, but what a bunch of people under the age of 30 are doing? No other races just like that, except black people. And then you have a whole bunch of old er people, which I’m part of 30, and up and who are responsible, we’re trying to do what they’re supposed to do. And unfortunately, they’re not on TV. They’re not the ones who you ask about people or property owners that kids have own boats and stuff to do. They’re not out there raising hell. But the media has made it seem like it and like you said, the movement has been co opted. So whether you’re white, black, brown, be safe. And in my opinion, as a black man, none of these protests are completely organic, only because digitally, they can track you on Facebook. They can see when you put the flyers up. I mean, it’s the surveillance is ridiculous on a lot of these sites. So yeah, it has been co opted But what can you do? And that’s why I present

Isaiah Jackson
An economic solution?

Elsa Ramon
An economic way to fight back? Yeah. This is the ultimate weapon to have, by the way, in my opinion, I know it is yours too. But I want to let people know that Bitcoin and black America you don’t have to feel like, Oh, well, that’s not me. I don’t how could this help me But truly, I told bill before we got started with all of us, is that I feel like you have given people here with this book, the keys to freedom, sovereignty, financial security, and growth, the answers, the secret codes, the keys, whatever you want to call it, are really all in this book and you so beautifully laid out. I truly feel like the book would be a gift to me. Anyone Yeah, white, black, brown, whatever. Because it really is enlightening and just so powerful. And I think this would be the gift the best gift to give anyone or to get. What’s your opinion?

Bill Deignan
I agree on. I think it’s in reading it. It was certainly enlightening to a lot of you know, the reality I can’t possibly relate to. But all of that aside, and I think is very empowering information for everyone. But just aside from all of that, if you want to know about crypto and how to move forward with it, this dude lays it out. And he gives you a just a ton of information that’s actionable. So don’t not pick it up because you might not be black. It’s man. This thing is loaded with great information for anybody to use. To learn and empower themselves with I think,

Elsa Ramon
If you’re just starting to learn, I don’t care what color you are, pick up this book, because you’re going to refer back to it many, many times, which is why I got all this stickies, no copious notes, just so I could refer back to it because I still feel like a newbie.

Isaiah Jackson
Oh, yeah. And I wanted to make it pretty simple so that beginners wouldn’t be overwhelmed. And I wanted to make pretty concise so that most people can get through it in a day or two, because I want people to stop reading as much and start doing stuff like after you read it. Alright, let’s start. You know, I’m one of those people that like action, and I don’t really like sitting around talking about it too much, especially once you know the problems. It’s on you to do something about it. So you’re an audiobook. No, sir. No audiobook for this version for the second edition. It will be yes.

Isaiah Jackson
And the second edition.

Isaiah Jackson
Yes. So the second edition for one year anniversary will be on July 11. It’ll be they It’ll be most of the chapters will be redone with more information, graphs, charts, and it’ll be hardcover. And yes, it’ll be scarce. So it only be a certain amount. And I’ll reveal all those details later. But yeah, yeah. We thought we’re discussing things like that now. So

Elsa Ramon
Wait a minute. Did people know about this the second edition coming? Or did we just get an exclusive?

Isaiah Jackson
Nope. This is the second show I’ve ever said it on. And, yes. Now everybody knows, like I said, just look out for the information will be all updated. It’ll be a whole lot more businesses, a whole lot more blockchain professionals, and more of a look at the global economy. You know, the International part was a little smaller now because I want to focus on america but globally. Yeah, I’ll bring a lot more so yes, look out for that.

Bill Deignan
See more pictures for guys like me. They’re visual learners. Exactly.

Isaiah Jackson
Graphs always good for some people. They can see it visually. I don’t even need to read the rest. So yes, I have some things like that. Cool.

Elsa Ramon
Well, Isaiah, it’s been a pleasure. I was so excited leading up to today. I really can’t tell you how much I was looking forward to talking with you and seeing you again since I saw you and met you last year. And to show off my signed copy that you gave me when I met you a year ago. I hope to see you again in person soon. And I would love to do future stories with you once Bill and I can get back on the road again with adventures and crypto we just can’t involves a lot of travels. So right now they’re not really a big option for us.

Bill Deignan
Yeah, you got to sign that iPad for me.

Isaiah Jackson
I appreciate it. But yeah, yeah.

Bill Deignan
Well, cool.

Elsa Ramon
Thank you so much. Again, I’ve done virtual hug. Thank you. Thank you. Sqn keep spreading the word will do.

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